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  • Handguns and firearms

    From the France attack thread, bfltdo wrote:

    Originally posted by bfltd0 View Post
    "An armed society is a polite society."

    Don't know who said it but I believe it to be true. At least in the armed societies I have spent time in.
    I didn't feel it was appropriate to post in that Thread so I thought I'd start a new one about handguns and ownership.

    I know that several Turfers are keen gun owners and I, personally, am interested to see and hear about this topic - I suspect that if I lived in the USA, I'd probably own one. As it is, living in the UK, I'll make do with my old Webley air rifle, for which current Govt. regs require me now to have a licence, and plinking tin cans in my back garden.

    Please let me be clear: this is not a Thread in which to discuss the opinions on pros and cons of gun ownership.

    Anyway, the preamble above notwithstanding, I did a Search of the old TURF because I wanted to reply to bfltd0's quote, and specifically I was looking for this one, below.
    It's from a TURFer called John_W, whose secondary nickname was Pimp Daddy! A Texan gentleman, big-bike riding lawyer, wearer of a diamond dial YG President (hence the nickname), aficionado of fountain pens, malt whiskies and guns, and an all-round good egg!

    -/- By John_W Date 2003-02-11 12:53 IP 66.76.4.71
    The last couple of posts reminded me of an incident several years ago:

    We were coming out of Houston's Jones Hall one winter's night; there was more than a sprinkling of mink and sable coats in evidence. The man walking to my right was a tall, gruff looking sort whose wife was wearing a full-length sable coat that probably set him back $50k to $75k USD.

    We get to the sidewalk and here comes Paint Boy striding purposefully toward this guy's wife with a coffee can full of red paint in his hand. The guy sees the can and steps in front of his wife to shield her, all the while opening his tux jacket to reveal a .45 caliber auto, no doubt legal under the concealed handgun laws.

    In a deep voice, he told Paint Boy, "Do that, sonny, and your mother will puke in your casket."

    Paint Boy continued on down the street, the red paint still in his can, not on the coat... not that I condone violence at any point, but that seemed damned effective to me.

    PD
    There's some choice stuff from him in this Thread, also: wanted-advice for first handgun purchase

  • #2
    Originally posted by harb View Post
    I know that several Turfers are keen gun owners and I, personally, am interested to see and hear about this topic...

    Please let me be clear: this is not a Thread in which to discuss the opinions on pros and cons of gun ownership.
    Hard to separate one from the other, harb, surely? I have to admit that it the present climate this makes me a little uncomfortable, especially if it turns into a gun ownership love fest. Sorry, just my view.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by learningtofly View Post

      Hard to separate one from the other, harb, surely? I have to admit that it the present climate this makes me a little uncomfortable, especially if it turns into a gun ownership love fest. Sorry, just my view.
      Nope - pretty easy.

      If you have an opinion that doesn't accord with the Thread, then don't post in this thread.
      I don't mean to be blunt - just being straightforward.

      Turf has always traditionally been able to discuss potentially contentious matters - rather than shutting them down like other forums.

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      • #4
        Ah, there was I thinking you were saying that there's no discussion to be had, harb - my mistake

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        • #5
          Originally posted by learningtofly View Post
          Ah, there was I thinking you were saying that there's no discussion to be had, harb - my mistake
          A discussion can, of course, also be had between like-minded individuals and simply be discourse on a particular topic - as here

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          • #6
            Harb;

            As you know, I am a gun owner in the USA. I have a few handguns... I also have a concealed weapon license which allows me to carry a pistol concealed on my person if I so choose although NOT is "sterile" areas like airports (past airport security), federal governmental buildings, schools, etc. I almost never carry on my person and only occasionally in a briefcase, backpack, etc. but I like having the option.

            I grew up in small town america and have been shooting firearms recreationally since before I could legally drive a car. I've never pointed a gun at a human and only rarely at any of gods creatures (only the tasty ones!). I think of guns and knives as tools not weapons although to a sufficiently imaginative bad guy, almost anything can be used as a weapon, even the most innocent looking things... From the movie John Wick >>> "I once saw him kill 3 guys in a bar with a pencil"... I giggle every time I fly because I can't take my Swiss Army penknife with the 1.25 inch blade on the plane (in my pocket) but the pen in my pocket makes it past security every time... I could kill someone much easier with the pen but it is allowed on the plane (in the passenger compartment) but not the SAK!

            As you know, I could go on at length on this topic but to save time and space, is there something specific you are interested in on this topic???

            - M -

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Reorx View Post
              ... I could kill someone much easier with the pen but it is allowed on the plane (in the passenger compartment) but not the SAK!

              As you know, I could go on at length on this topic but to save time and space, is there something specific you are interested in on this topic???

              - M -
              You know what they say about the pen being mightier than the sword...

              TBH, I just wanted to reply to bfltd0's post in that other thread but didn't feel it was appropriate there.
              What he said reminded me of Pimp Daddy's post from 15 years ago - I have always remembered that.
              I suppose some could consider that to be a "polite society" in action.
              PD certainly had an evocative way of putting things.

              During my trawl through some historical posts on old TURF to find PD's post, I came across the other one for which I've given the link - in it, PD emphasises to learn to double tap a target.
              It's interesting, then, that you mention John Wick. You'll know, of course, that he uses the Mozambique Drill (or triple tap) with the CAR style of shooting.

              I'm just idly musing about this stuff since it's so far removed from my own experience.

              Comment


              • #8
                There are wide variations in State Laws here. I am not an expert on even the laws in my state, let alone any others. But there are considerations of brandishing, and having to be an "unwilling participant" in a defensive use. Armed or not, I stay away from areas that are the slightest bit questionable. My firearms interest is far more of a sporting nature than a defensive one. I reload my own ammo and target shoot at least once a week in the winter, far more often in the summer when the outdoor ranges are open.

                I have a carry permit mostly because It makes transporting guns and ammo to and from the ranges much easier as there is no need to separate the ammo from the firearm, etc. I very rarely carry. Even small firearms seem to get larger and heavier the longer you carry them.

                There is also a great deal of hyperbole regarding anecdotes on the carry subject. I think there's an element of machismo involved. Just like the guy with the Porsche who says he outran the cops at 200mph. Sure.

                I have a lot of equipment as I reload over 20 calibers and have 77 handguns and 5 rifles. Here is my workshop. It's better organized than it appears. AS Reorx said above I could well expand on the topic and fully respect and agree with Harb's directive NOT to turn this into a pro/anti discussion. I am happy to discuss the subject within the guidelines with respect.





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                • #9
                  Harb, lots of mis-information in that link you posted, to wit: Nothing to backup this statement.

                  <
                  First off, if you are going to buy a semi-automatic the only sensible choice is a .45 ACP. I personally favor single action .45 autos, but if you have no experience shooting you may find mastering one a little intimidating.>

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                  • #10
                    I have many fond memories of John_W - he was an AAG in Texas and an interesting fellow... very colorful speech, great stories... I read the thread at the link... I can't believe that I didn't make a single post in that thread... I must have been out of town,

                    Agree with "a lot of misinformation in that thread".

                    I recently put together a reloading bench. Current I just reload "precision" .308. I am currently in search of the holy grail... the "1 load"...

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                    • #11
                      I remember him writing that post all those years ago.

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                      • #12
                        I had a 308 when I lived in AZ in the early 70's. The range I went to is still there, however much expanded. I didn't shoot the 308 very often or well enough to keep it. I found my interest more in handguns. I have a few vintage S&W's from the 70's. For $50 you can get a letter of providence from S&W's historian which describes the firearm, and factory options, and states the dealer to which it was shipped and on what date. Good to have. Two of the three were shipped to the same local dealer who is no longer in business.

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                        • #13
                          I grew up in the Scottish Highlands and had an air rifle - I mainly shot tin cans and various targets in the garden, but a friend and I would often head off into the hills for a day with our rifles. I don't recall actually shooting anything but for a 14 year old it seemed like a lot of fun!

                          Later on I also used shotguns and occasionally went stalking with the local gamekeeper. I guess I learnt some basic firearms safety through those experiences.

                          I still have my old .22 air rifle that I received as an Xmas present in 1983 - I had it serviced a few years ago and it is now more powerful than I ever remember it being, even when new.

                          I introduced my older son to plinking cans when he was about 5 and we'd visit my folks in the Highlands - he'd rest the rifle on a chair and then would aim it himself. He was a pretty decent shot!

                          He's recently asked me about shooting it again but it's a bit different now that we live in the city. However, we have a space between our boundary wall and an extension to the house. It's probably about 15 yards ending in a 2' high retaining wall holding up a grassy embankment - feels like a natural shooting range. I also have a knock-down enclosed target for extra safety, not that the pellets will go anywhere.

                          He goes into senior school next year and will be joining the Cadets. He told me that's what's behind him wanting to shoot, so now that the good weather is coming I hope to help him learn.

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                          • #14
                            In the vast majority of our suburbs (and inner city) discharging a firearm is a crime, even if it's a BB or pellet gun. I have a natural berm behind our house but I'd be in deep trouble if I fired a gun at it.

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                            • #15
                              Whilst I have done very little in the way of shooting I remember on a trip to Scotland going for a morning to be taught how to shoot with a shotgun which was very enjoyable. I think it may have been on the Rothimurchie estate near aviemore . A bad week for skiing but interesting for other things.
                              Like anything, done responsibly it is fine ,living rurally I see a lot of people shooting anything that moves ,or attempting to!and have very little time for them, whether hunting is part of their culture or not.
                              I can see the enjoyment out of target shooting as a Hobby but wouldn't feel the need to go shooting for live animals unless it was to kill for eating then there is justification for doing so.

                              I can't say that I have visited many armed society's but in the case of Harbs illustrated point it would seem that an awful lot of commotion and trouble was avoided by a responsible way of handling the situation.

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